Unfortunately, it appears that breeders and supporters of albinistic Dobermans don't advertise honestly in many cases. Here's a few specific examples of false or misleading advertisement by breeders and supporters of albino Dobermans.

The White Doberman Club itself, the parent club for breeders of albinistic Dobermans, makes quite a few false or misleading statements on its web site:

1. They state: "The 'white' Doberman is not any different from the other colors - they are the same except for their coat and eye color." see the quote here

As discussed throughout this document, albinism is NOT just another color. Rather, it includes a variety of syndromes which can affect health as well as behavior in many ways.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , "does albinism affect health" , and "does albinism affect behavior" sections elsewhere on this site for more specific information on some of the ways in which albinism affects health and behavior

2. They state:"The white Doberman is American Kennel Club (AKC) registrable. They can be shown in all AKC sanctioned events except for conformation which means they can never become champions but they can acquire AKC obedience, agility, tracking, etc. titles, or titles from other sports such as Schutzhund."see the quote here and "many contemporary white Dobermans are earning obedience titles, passing various types of temperament tests, are working as therapy dogs, etc."see the quote here and "Some are working in obedience, Schutzhund" see the quote here

Actually, only four albino Dobermans have ever received ANY AKC-sanctioned performance titles in the 25 year history of the mutation. All four have earned only the most basic performance titles recognized by the AKC -- three CDs, and one NAJ (Novice Agility, Jumpers). I have not been able to find records of ANY albino Dobermans with ANY other verified performance titles, whether in obedience, schutzhund, agility, flyball, ring sport, tracking, or any of the other activities in which normal Dobermans excel. If albino Dobermans earned AKC obedience titles at the same rate as normal Dobermans, they would have earned roughly TWENTY CDs as well as many other titles by now. But they have not.

Refer to the "does albinism affect behavior" and "performance title offer" sections for more specific information.

3. They state: "Due to pressure exerted by the long and well-funded arm of the Doberman Pinscher Club of America (DPCA), the AKC agreed to distinguish, and thereby discriminate against all dogs that descend from the parents of Padula's Queen Shebah by putting a Z in the registration number (i.e. WZ000000/00). This has not been done by any other national breed club - the Rottweiler Club of America has not so distinguished the red Rottweiler, nor has the Boxer Club of America so distinguished the solid white Boxer. Only the DPCA has chosen to implement this form of outright discrimination. "see the quote here

This statement is basically true, but it is misleading because of its comparisons to red rottweilers and white boxers.

It is absolutely true that the DPCA fought to have a tracking system put in place to identify possible carriers of the albino gene. Since carriers look like normal dogs, and since there is currently no genetic test available to detect carriers, the z list is the ONLY way to tell which dogs can or can not produce albinistic offspring -- except for actually breeding them! And since responsible breeders want to breed AWAY from genetic defects rather than TOWARDS them, the membership of the DPCA overwhelmingly supported the creation of the z list. With the z list in place, responsible breeders can avoid producing albino puppies accidently, and the albino gene can be isolated from the normal population.

The situations with red rottweilers and white boxers are VERY different than that found with albino dobermans. First, "red" in rottweilers is JUST a color. It is caused by the recessive b gene, just as it is in dobermans. The red color has no established health or behavioral effects. Second, the gene producing "white" in boxers is ALREADY spread throughout the boxer population. In fact, the dogs with the most "desirable" color pattern in boxers -- the "flashy" boxers -- are ALL carriers of the "white" (extreme spotting) gene. Therefore, it is physically IMPOSSIBLE to isolate the white/spotting gene from the rest of the boxer population. In contrast, the albino trait in Dobermans is a trait which does have established health and behavioral effects, and it is possible to isolate the trait from the normal population -- by the use of the z list.

For more specific information on white boxers, look here and here.
Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , "does albinism affect health" , and "does albinism affect behavior" sections elsewhere on this site for more specific information on some of the ways in which albinism affects health and behavior

The WDC calls the z list "outright discrimination". Responsible breeders call it "protecting the breed from genetic defects".

The z list can be found here.

4. They state: "Most current breeders, including all WDC members who sign and adhere to a strict Code of Ethics, are striving to improve the conformation, intelligence and workability of these beautiful animals." "Some issues that member breeders have been working on are the overall conformation, workability and temperaments of our dogs,always breeding with IMPROVING the color variety overall at the forefront of any member breeding program. "see the quote here and "We strive to improve the breed with each breeding we do. Constantly improving temperament, health and conformation." see the quote here

Breeders who "strive to improve conformation" must choose breeding animals of good conformation. This process involves testing the quality of one's dogs through conformation events, especially AKC sanctioned shows. Unfortunately, breeders of albino dobermans are not commonly seen competing in these shows. Although albino Dobermans are not permitted in the show ring, their normally-colored siblings ARE. Nonetheless, there appear to be NO factored Dobermans with AKC championships, or even with any conformation points TOWARDS a championship. In fact, I know of only ONE factored Doberman who has even been SHOWN in an AKC sanctioned show -- and this dog placed last in its class. If breeders of albino Dobermans were actually concerned with improving conformation, they would be participating in many AKC events with their factored dogs. But they are not. (If anyone knows of any other albino-factored Dobermans competing in AKC sanctioned shows, please let me know!)

As for improving "intelligence and workability", once again we are faced with the fact that only FOUR albino Dobermans have been awarded any performance titles in the 25 years that albino Dobermans have existed. "The proof is in the pudding", as they say.

5. The WDC home page originally included a photograph showing an albino Doberman standing with a police officer in uniform, next to a police cruiser, with the seal of the department at the top. The use and positioning of the photo, next to paragraphs of text extolling the supposed working abilities of albino Dobermans, clearly implied that the dog was an official part of the police department.

I have spoken personally with the officer who owns this dog. Actually, the dog is the officer's personal dog, and does not participate in any official police activities. In fact, the photograph is actually the front of a card. The back of the card clearly explains that the dog is a personal, and not official, dog. Somehow the WDC web master forgot to include that information on the web page.

After the police department named in this photograph was notified that its name and seal were being published on the WDC site without its permission, the photograph was edited. As of 5/15/01, the photo showed only the officer in uniform, a portion of the police cruiser, and the dog. All identifying information about the specific police department was removed. Further, the photo was removed from the home page altogether as of 5/21/01. Thanks, WDC, for removing that misleading photograph!

for additional information on the officer and dog, please contact me

6. They state: "Another issue is sensitivity to bright light which is something that any light skinned, light eyed mammal experiences - be it man, horse or whatever. Not all white Dobes exhibit this behavior, and some non-white Dobes, such as fawns and blues and even reds also squint in the sun, so this is not necessarily a color specific issue.This does not prevent the white Dobes from doing their jobs as home companions and protectors, obedience and agility competitors, and so on. "see the quote here

Actually, photophobia is a very well known effect of albinism, in many different species.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , and "does albinism affect health" sections above for more specific information.

As for "doing their jobs as home companions and protectors, obedience and agility competitors, and so on", please refer to the paragraphs immediately above for details on the extensive FAILURES of albino Dobermans to act as obedience and agility competitors "and so on".

7. They state: "Overall, the health of the white Doberman is no different from that of its non-white counterparts. They have the same major health issues such as cardiomyopathy and von Willebrands disease" see the quote here

It is true that albino Dobermans DO have the same major health issues as normal dobermans. In fact, since breeders of albino Dobermans tend not to screen their breeding stock for genetic diseases, one might expect that the rate of these diseases will be even higher in the albino population than elsewhere. However, albinos ALSO suffer from the health problems specifically associated with albinism.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , and "does albinism affect health" sections above for more specific information.

8. They state: "They have the same major health issues such as cardiomyopathy and von Willebrands disease and all WDC breeders screen their breeding stock for these maladies."see the quote here and "on occasion these problems are still in puppies, but theses individuals are NOT used for breeding by any WDC member breeder." see the quote here

Actually, the president of the WDC herself was recently accused by several other WDC members of breeding two vWD affected dogs to each other. In fact, her stud dog -- Maximillian International, WZ00090201 (reported to be vWD affected), has apparently produced litters with both Mapleleaf's Ruby Red, WZ000910/04 (reported to be vWD affected), and Zaure Akira of Remz, WP891225/02 (reported to be a vWD carrier). Additionally, both of these litters are reported to have contained multiple monorchid and cryptorchid pups. Maximillian is also reported to have produced a third litter, with another vWD affected albino bitch. Additionally, none of these dogs appear in either the OFA or CERF databases. I have repeatedly asked the WDC president herself to give me her viewpoint on these accusations, but so far she has not responded to my inquiries. If any of these reports are in error, please let me know!

to search the OFA database, look here; to search the CERF database, look here

As quoted elsewhere on the WDC site: "Even though it is possible that there will be some clear puppies when breeding "Carrier to Carrier", in general, neither this type of breeding pair nor "Carrier to Affected" are recommended for breeding....[Affected to Affected] Breeding Not Recommended. All puppies will be medically Affected. " see the quote here

Although these accusations still appear to be true, the president has not been removed from office. And since the membership list of the WDC is kept secret, it is impossible to verify which other members may or may not be living up to the bold claims made by the WDC concerning the health testing done by its members. Since many albino breeders are known to NOT screen for genetic diseases, and they don't even test the temperaments or conformation of their dogs through competition, it seems likely that these claims fall quite short of reality.

9. They state:"These dogs didn't ask to be born - they have a right to life just like any other Doberman."see the quote here

It is absolutely true that these dogs didn't ask to be born. That is why the BREEDERS are responsible for breeding AWAY from genetic defects, rather than TOWARDS them.

10. They state: "The white Doberman is not a true albino since it does have coloration to the coat, and the eyes are blue; a true albino has red eyes."see the quote here

Actually, MANY albinos -- partial albinos -- have some coat pigmentation. And many albinos also have blue eyes, even those with no pigment whatsoever ("true" albinos).

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "health" sections above for more specific information.

11. They state: "Incidently, the genetic 'anomaly' which resulted in the white Doberman is the same as is seen in the beautiful white tigers and lions owned by the famous Siegfried and Roy in Las Vegas. "see the quote here and"(Incidentally, this is the same gene which produced the famous white tigers and lions owned by Siegfriend & Roy in Las Vegas)." see the quote here

Actually, anyone who has seen "white" tigers knows that they still have black stripes! In contrast, the areas that should be black on an albino doberman are pale cream instead. These are obviously different traits.

See several photos of white tigers here.

12. They state: "There are many clubs and individuals that would say these dogs should be destroyed at birth, that they are not healthy, that they have problems, etc. These same folks destroy blues and fawns at birth simply because of their color."see the quote here

Actually, I have yet to hear of a SINGLE club in the United States which would advocate killing albino Doberman puppies at birth. If anyone finds such a policy anywhere, please let me know! The Doberman Pinscher Club of America (DPCA), in its Operation White Out, recommends that albino Dobermans be spayed or neutered -- not killed. And since fawns and blues are both accepted in the AKC Doberman standard, and are earning more and more championships every day, precisely which "folks" are the WDC accusing of killing dilute puppies?

The DPCA's Operation White Out policy can be found here

13. They state: "There is no evidence however, that this gene carries with it any deleterious or adverse health concerns that are sometimes associated with all white animals such as deafness, blindness, or unstable minds. " see the quote here

Actually, there are MOUNTAINS of evidence that albinism in general, and albinism in Dobermans in particular, causes SEVERAL "deleterious or adverse" health and behavioral effects. Specifically, these dogs very often suffer from problems with skin, vision, and temperament.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , "does albinism affect health" , and "does albinism affect behavior" sections above for more specific information.

Interestingly, the WDC itself admits that early albino Dobermans suffered from serious problems. For instance, they state: "Some of the more prevalent problems included aggression and fear biting.....on occasion these problems are still in puppies...." see the quote here

14. They state: "Please keep in mind that the Doberman Pinscher breed itself is a mixed breed that's a little more than a 100 years old. " see the quote here

Actually, many breeds of purebred dogs have come into existence within the last 100 years or so. For instance, the German Shepherd Dog was first accepted into the AKC in 1908; the Boxer was accepted in 1904; the Labrador Retriever was accepted in 1917; the Miniature Schnauzer was accepted in 1926; and so on. Are any of these dogs "mixed breeds"?? Of course not!

15. They state: "Some of the breeds used, mostly notably, the Greyhound (introduced by USA breeders into the US gene pool in approximately 1908), come in many colors including solid white, so it was only a matter of time before the anomaly occurred. " see the quote here

Actually, the white trait in greyhounds -- an extreme spotting trait -- is quite different from the albino trait in Dobermans. And the occasional white toe and chest markings found in Dobermans are NOT caused by the gene for spotting, but rather by the interaction of multiple genes together (polygenic modifiers).

Refer to the "color" section above for a general description of white in greyhounds, and look here for more specific information on color inheritance in greyhounds.

And incidentally, the greyhound was NOT introduced into the doberman breed by US breeders. In fact, greyhound blood was introduced into the breed in Germany, in 1908. And notice that the dog was a BLACK greyhound, not spotted at all.

"The most interesting event of the year [the year 1908] was the appearance of the somewhat legendary black bitch, Stella. Her origin and pedigree appeared unfathomable and all that is positively known about her is that she was whelped in Ried, Hessia (Germany). All stud book entries vary on the important point of origin. Our personal investigation, undertaken and finished in her lifetime, would bear out the conclusion that she was the product of a black English Greyhound dog and a black Dobermann bitch." (p. 171) From The Doberman Pinscher: History and Development of the Breed by Philipp Gruenig, first published (in German) in 1934; quoted from the 1959 edition.

16. They state: "We are certain that the whites HAVE existed in the past and in fact, Shebah's dam, Dynamo Humm, produced a white male pup in a previous litter by a different stud. Shebah was simply the first lucky one to be allowed to survive and then registered with the AKC." see the quote here

Actually, "certainty" and "truth" are often quite different things. I have offered a $200 reward for proof of the existence of albino Dobermans that have NOT descended from Shebah or her parents. So far there has been NO serious evidence offered of such a dog. In fact, every AKC registered albino Doberman can trace its ancestry back to these dogs. (Seven dogs NOT descended from Shebah that were originally registered as "white" and included on the z list were believed by both AKC officials and the DPCA to be mis-registered fawns.) Also, there is no firm evidence that Shebah's brother ever actually existed; and, even if he did, there is even LESS evidence that he actually had a different sire than Shebah.

I am not aware of any documented evidence that other albinos have ever occurred elsewhere in the breed. If anyone has documented evidence of albinistic Dobermans not descended from Shebah, please let me know!

I have made an offer to reward anyone who can prove the existence of any albino/white Doberman not related to Shebah. For details, please see the "Non-Shebah pedigree offer" section below.

For more specific information on the origin of albino Dobermans, please refer to the "Where did albino Dobermans come from?" section of this site.

17. The WDC's Code of Ethics states: "1.To provide accurate and ongoing information to the general public about the White and White Factored Doberman Pinschers. " see the quote here

Actually, we've seen through many examples above just how much INaccurate information is presented on the WDC's own official web site. How can people expect their accuracy to be any better when the WDC disseminates its "information" elsewhere?

18. The WDC's Code of Ethics states: "2.To work together to dispel condemnation of the White Doberman Pinschers based solely upon their color. " see the quote here

Actually, since condemnation of the albino Doberman is based on the syndrome of albinism rather than "solely upon their color", this element of the WDC's COE is a non-issue.

19. The WDC's Code of Ethics states: "4.To support the White Doberman Club in its efforts to gain recognition and acceptability. " see the quote here

If the WDC members actually want to "gain recognition and acceptability", why are they not participating in the recognized and acceptable canine activities such as AKC-sanctioned conformation and performance trials?

20. The WDC's Code of Ethics states: "6.To promote the showing of the White and White Factored Dobermans in any accepted matches or show events. " see the quote here

If the WDC members actually want to "promote the showing of the White and White Factored Dobermans", why are they not participating in recognized and acceptable canine activities such as AKC-sanctioned conformation and performance trials?

21. The WDC's Code of Ethics states: "8.To strive to develop as close as possible to AKC standards, the best quality White Doberman Pinscher possible ~ in body and mind. " see the quote here

If the WDC members actually want to "strive to develop as close as possible to AKC standards", why are they not participating in recognized and acceptable canine activities such as AKC-sanctioned conformation and performance trials?

22. They state: " Ice Phantom, CGC, NAJ, which stands for Novice Agility (JWW). We now get to move up to OPEN JWW and then on to EXCELLENT after getting three qualifying scores (legs) in OPEN. On Saturday, Sept. 23rd, we got a qualifying score in the Jumpers with Weaves (our 2nd leg) AND TOOK A FIRST PLACE RIBBON OVER ALL OTHER NOVICE A HANDLERS IN THE 24" DIVISION! " "WE DID IT AGAIN!!!!! On Sunday, Sept. 24th, we got a qualifying score in the Novice Jumpers with Weaves which was our third and final leg for Novice!!!! NOT ONLY THAT, BUT WE ALSO TOOK A SECOND PLACE RIBBON!!!! " see the quote here

Actually, as discussed below, these claims are artificially inflated by being taken out of context. For more specific information, please refer to the sub-section on Cornett, farther down in this section.

Last update 6/7/01

Donna Anzaldi, of Tourmaline Kennels, makes the following false or misleading statements:

1. She states: "Tourmaline Kennels was a member of the W.D.P.C.A. now the W.D.C. And has been registering/showing Quality Dobermans with the A.K.C. since 1992 ". see the quote here

Actually, as detailed below, the only two Tourmaline dogs for whom she claims show success actually have no AKC conformation points.

2. She states: "Red Split to white, shown here at 6 months old. B.O.B. Suffolk county NY on 7-31-93 It doesnt have to be a point show to count, It is impressive for any 6 month old puppy to win the breed over experienced handlers." see the quote here

Actually, this dog has no "conformation points", which are the points awarded at AKC-sanctioned dog shows to the top dogs in each breed at each show. Her dog has never won BOB in any AKC-sanctioned, pointed event, and in fact placed fourth in his class (there are several classes within each breed) at the only AKC-sanctioned Suffolk County show in which he participated.

And yes, it DOES "have to be a point show to count". Non-pointed matches are often referred to as "fun" matches -- because they are only for fun and practice, and do NOT actually test the dog's conformation in any meaningful way.

For more specific information on this dog's actual show career, look here.

3. She states that the dog who supposedly had the BOB was named "Tourmalines Roll N Rock". see the quote here

Actually, there is no Doberman named "Tourmalines Roll N Rock" in the AKC database, nor any Doberman named simply "Roll N Rock". In fact, the dog she is referring to is named "Rolling Rock". She doesn't even know the registered name of a dog she has bred herself!

For more specific information on this dog, look here.

4. She states that fawns do not "qualify by the standard" for the Doberman pinscher.see the quote here

Actually, fawns were accepted into the AKC standard for Doberman pinschers in 1969 -- more than thirty years ago.

see the AKC Doberman pinscher standard here.

5. She states: Tourmalines Blaze of Glory at 7 months old. Nassau Collesium. This was a two day show.....The second day We took a third place in his group (*which is what the judge called it..the 6-9 month group)...." see the quote here

Actually, this dog took third in his CLASS at that show. There are several classes within each breed. A "group" competition is when dogs of several different breeds compete against each other AFTER having won Best of Breed in their respective breeds -- so placing in GROUP competition is a much bigger deal than placing in one's CLASS. In fact, like Rolling Rock, Tourmalines Blaze of Glory has NO conformation points in ANY AKC-sanctioned events.

For more specific information on this dog's actual show career, look here.

6. She states: "White Dobermans are cream with white markings..and blue eyes. They are a partial albinoism, meaning hair is fully pigmented and have lovely course thick coats." see the quote here

At least Donna DOES admit here that "white" Dobermans are partial albinos. However, partial albinism does NOT mean that "hair is fully pigmented" -- only that some RESIDUAL pigmentation does remain. If these dogs were fully pigmented, they would be black, red, fawn, or blue -- they would be normal Dobermans.

Refer to the "what is albinism" section for more specific information

7. She states: "We have to stop show people and people from the doberman clubs from condeming them to death! These people seem to believe if white dobermans are not winning obedience titles..they should be dead." and "The anti white doberman people think that unless the dog is winning in the show grounds, it should be dead." see the quotes here and "By z registering whites and trying to ban them from the akc, they are comdemning them to death." see the quote here

Actually, as mentioned above, I have yet to hear of a SINGLE club in the United States which would advocate killing albino Dobermans. If anyone finds such a policy anywhere, please let me know! The Doberman Pinscher Club of America (DPCA), in its Operation White Out, recommends that albino Dobermans be spayed or neutered -- not killed.

The DPCA's Operation White Out policy can be found here

In fact, Donna even contradicts herself on this issue. On another page, she states: "All whites and splits with z in akc registrations only make it easier to reproduce these cream colored beauties with blue eyes!! Look for the Z it will confirm white genetics and help increase the number of white Doberman beauties!!" see the quote here

8. She states: "I have a friend whos white won his CDX 6 years ago. " see the quote here

Actually, NO albino Doberman has EVER been awarded a CDX title. The dog to which she is referring, Warrior's Magic Crystal, did earn a CD in 1993. He is one of the only 3 albino Dobermans in history to win any AKC-recognized obedience titles.

To see these and other claims at her site and in her emails to me, look hereand here.

Last update 6/7/01

Lorri Nichiow, of Lornich Kennels, makes the following false or misleading statements:

1. She states that Lornich Kennels is "home of Top Champions since 1974" and "Here at Lornich Kennels we take great pride in our dogs, producing superior, healthy puppies out of our Top Champions. " see quote here.

Actually, I have names and registration numbers for five hundred "Lornich" Dobermans, and none of the dogs for whom I have information have AKC championships. If anyone knows of ANY Lornich dogs who have earned AKC championship titles, please let me know!

For a list of the names and numbers, look here.

2. She states: "All pups are given full and proper vaccinations for their age, are paper trained, crate trained and come with our "Lifetime Guarantee" We our one of the few kennels that back our dogs up 100% ." see the quote here

Actually, I have a copy of Lornich's guarantee for a dog purchased in 1998. Now, it is possible that her guarantee has been rewritten since the one for which I have a copy -- and, if so, I hope Lorri will send me a copy of the new version. In the meantime, though, the guarantee for which I have a copy states:"9. REPLACEMENT GUARANTEE WILL BE TERMINATED****If dog has been abused, does not have the proper shots given by vet, ears not cropped in long show cut or standing, has been trained inefficiently (by Lornich standards), does not carry the "Lornich" prefix on AKC papers. Dog cannot be spayed or neutered. Dog cannot be bred unless it is show quality."

for a copy of the Lornich guarantee, please contact me

Notice that the guarantee is voided if the ears aren't cut long enough; if the ears aren't standing; if the dog hasn't been trained up to Lornich standards; or if the dog is neutered!

Last update 6/7/01

Lysa Rector, of Whispering Woods Kennels, makes the following false or misleading statements:

1. She states that "I do OFA my stud dogs" and "Stud dogs are O.F.A. certified." see the quotes here

Actually, several dogs used for stud at Whispering Woods or advertised as studs at Whispering Woods, or sires of dogs sold by Whispering Woods, are not OFA certified or were not at the time of advertisement and/or breeding. For instance, neither Phantom's Dark Magician (Magic) nor Phantom's Traveling Man (Travis) were OFA certified at the time they were first advertised at stud on the Whispering Woods site. Magic and Travis had each been bred at least once before OFA certification. Travis was transferred to another breeder close to Lysa's home, and sired a litter whelped on 8/5/00. He did not appear in the OFA hip registry until 8/24/00. He is now listed once again as a stud dog on the Whispering Woods site.

Another Phantom dog, Phantom's Blueprint, was whelped on 9/21/99, and himself sired a litter whelped 8/20/00. In other words, he was bred at only NINE months of age! Obviously he had not been OFA'd either.

Other dogs who have sired puppies sold by Whispering Woods, but who do not appear in the OFA database, include Krystal Palace's Cameo, Drachen's A Fool N My Money, and W.W. Classic Vintage.

Further, her three current "Phantom line" stud dogs -- Phantom's Prodigy, Phantom's U.S. Blues, and Phantom's Traveling Man -- are certified by the OFA but all only received "fair" ratings. Most reputable breeders will not breed to dogs with less than "good" ratings. Phantom's Dark Magician was also eventually OFA certified, after being bred at least once and after being advertised at stud. He also received only a "fair" rating.

For specific information on the OFA certifications of Whispering Woods dogs, search the OFA database here.

2. At the end of July, 2000, the following statement was added to the Whispering Woods site: "Additionally, as a matter of record, Magic has never been bred." see the quote here

Interestingly, Lysa Rector told me herself in private email that Magic had been bred, in a message dated 11/26/99. Specifically, she stated "Actually, Magic (Phantom's Dark Magician) has been OFA'd but I have not yet gotten the results. The bitch he was bred to is OFA'd" see the message here

Obviously, one of these two statements is untrue -- even though both statements were made by the same person.

3. She states that "They do not look white due to a lack of pigment as is the case with a true albino; they look white because they have white pigment." see the quote here and "White Dobermans do have white pigment" see the quote here

Actually, I do not know of any existing evidence which would support this statement. As described in several sections above, "white" Dobermans do indeed appear to be tyrosinase-positive albinos. In fact, so far as I know there is no such thing as "white pigment" in any mammal. If anyone has evidence of "white pigment" in albino Dobermans, please let me know!

4. She states that white Dobermans "can be competed in any and all other A.K.C. dog-events!!! (Including the Canine Good Citizenship Program, Obedience, Tracking, Schutzhund, Ring Sport, Flyball, Agility, Temperament Testing Program, etc.)" see the quote here.

Actually, only four albino Dobermans have ever earned any AKC-sanctioned performance titles, in the 25-year history of the mutation. And these are three CDs and one NAJ, all the most basic levels of titles awarded. No albino Dobermans have any advanced performance titles in obedience, tracking, schutzhund, ring sport, flyball, or agility. It may be true that these dogs canbe competed in other events, but they appear to be incapable of doing so.

Refer to the "behavior" section above for more specific information.
I have made an offer to reward anyone who can obtain advanced performance titles on any albino Doberman. For details, please see the "Performance title offer" section below.

5. She states that "Many of the "Pro-white Doberman" people claim that the whites are healthier than Dobermans of other colors - not actually because of their color, but because responsible breeders of white Dobermans are using Health as a basis for their breeding programs." see the quote here.

Actually, albino breeders do not even appear to be generally screening their dogs for genetic health defects before breeding. See some of the comments regarding other breeders on this page for a few additional examples of albino breeders not screening for health problems in their breeding stock. Also, I have verifiable information for only three albino Dobermans who have reached eight years of age (two alive and one dead), three living nine year olds, one who is alive at ten, and one trustworthy report of another dog who died at 10 years of age (please let me know if you have verifiable information regarding albinos surviving longer than this!). In fact, the only albino Doberman who did complete the highest level of health screening offered by the WDC, Spears Duke of Kettering, recently died at 5 years of age. Another well-known albino stud, Thunderidges King of Diamonds, died in November of 2000 at 6 years of age. see their memorials here. This is not a good record of health for a mutation which has existed since 1976! In stark contrast, it is easy to find normal Dobermans surviving to 10, 12, 14, and even occasionally 17 years of age.

Refer to the "health" and "ethical breeding" sections for more specific information.

6. She states that "Breeding animals from both Doberman lines meet the A.K.C. breed standard and have no faults that would disqualify them from the show ring, the only exceptions to this being a few that are slightly too large and the white Dobermans from the Phantom line. All are thyroid tested in the normal range, and DNA tested free of vWD." see the quote here

As she admits herself, none of the "white" Phantom dogs meet the AKC breed standard -- because albinism in itself is a disqualification. Further, all three of her currently advertised Phantom stud dogs -- Phantom's Prodigy, Phantom's U.S. Blues, and Phantom's Traveling Man -- are listed as vWD carrierson the OFA database site rather than as vWD clear. They are not "free" of vWD, they actually carry the trait. Only two of her dogs, Phantom's Southern Belle and Phantom's Dreams Come True, are listed as vWD clear in the OFA database.

To search the OFA database, look here.

7. She states that "It is important to note that 'white' is just another color". see the quote here

As discussed throughout this document, albinism is NOT just another color. Rather, it includes a variety of syndromes which can affect health as well as behavior in many ways. Please refer to the rest of the document above for more specific information.

8. She states that "Most Blues and fawns (called dilutes in reference to the silvery tones on the lightened Blacks and reds) tend to have skin problems associated with a defective thyroid gland" and "Hypothyroidism - This is the thyroid disease commonly associated with dilute colored Dobermans and also referred to as "Blue Doberman Disease" or CDA (Color Dilution Alopecia). " see the quotes here

Actually, CDA is NOT associated with hypothyroidism. Hypothyroidism and CDA are completely different medical conditions. Hypothyroidism is not especially associated with dilute colors of Dobermans, and in fact black and red Dobermans can and often do suffer from hypothyroidism.

For more specific information on CDA, please refer to the "color" section above and look here and here.

9. She states that "Hip Dysplasia is not a significant problem in standard sized Dobermans" see the quote here.

It is true that Dobermans are not one of the breeds most at risk of dysplasia. However, as the OFA site notes, only 16.3 % of submitted xrays from Dobermans received "excellent" ratings. In addition, 6.3% were rated as dysplastic. Given that most owners will realize that their dogs are dysplastic before the xrays are ever sent to the OFA, this rating is most likely a serious underestimate of the true incidence.

For more specific information on OFA ratings, look here.

10. She states that "show prospects are available upon request" see the quote here.

Since albinism is a disqualification for showing, none of the albino dogs can be show prospects.

11. She states that "Some of these adults as well as a couple of neutered males and spayed females are available for sale or adoption. (To answer a frequently asked question, NO! Our older/retired dogs are NOT available for sale or adoption.) " see the quote here

Actually, at least two of her previous stud dogs -- Phantom's Dark Magician (Magic) and Phantom's Traveling Man (Travis) -- were transferred to other owners in the spring of 2000 (Lysa has now apparently re-acquired Travis). At least two others -- including Krystal Palace's Cameo and Lysa's Dogasaurus Rex -- were advertised for sale slightly before that. Drachen's a Fool N' My Money and Valkyre's Seize the Fire (Vanna) are two other former breeding dogs which she transferred to other breeders within the last year (Vanna changed hands in July of 2000). Another dog listed on her breeding bitches page, Phantom's Stargazer, is being offered for sale as of 5/7/01 and has been for at least the last five months.

12. She advertises one of her stud dogs as "Phantom's Prodigy OFA BH TT CGC (Drizzt) " see the dog's description here

Actually, there appears to be no documented evidence that this dog ever earned a BH (a basic aptitude certification within the Schutzhund system, awarded by either USA, UDC, or DVG dog clubs). Lysa Rector has admitted herself that she has no supporting documentation for this supposed title. Further, a thorough search of trial records from the USA, UDC, and DVG clubs has uncovered no record that such a title was ever awarded to a dog named either "Phantom's Prodigy" or "Drizzt".

13. She states that "Please note that because these lines are being perpetuated for different reasons, no crossing between these two Doberman lines is ever done. They are treated as though they were two totally separate breeds." see the quote here.

Actually, there are at least two dogs which have been or are being used to produce both "Kristy Line" and "Phantom Line" litters. For instance, Drachen's a Fool ' N My Money (Luke) was used to sire a Phantom litter with the dam Phantom's Wish Upon a Star, born 8/21/97; a "Kristy" pup (born 12/4/99) was also sold by Whispering Woods in the spring of 2000, produced from a mating between Luke and Lisa von Paradox. Similarly, Valkyre's Seize the Fire has been previously used to produce a "Kristy" litter with the stud W.W. Rocket's Red Glare as well as being bred to Luke, and in 7/2000 she was transferred to Melissia Modrak to be bred to Phantom's Alaska Ice Storm.

See the Drachen/Phantom litter's pedigree here
See a copy of the ad for the Drachen/von Paradox litter pup here and a mention of the litter here
See the Valkyre/W.W. litter's pedigree here
See a mention of the Valkyre/Drachen litter here
See the announcement of the upcoming Valkyre/Phantom litter here

L
ast update 5/7/01

Ê

Denise Harrison, of Dobenar Kennels, makes the following false or misleading statements

1. She states that "The [sic] have BLUE eyes - therefore are not true albinos. " see the quote here.

As has been explained above, many albinos do have blue eyes -- including albinos with absolutely no pigment production ("true" albinos).

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "health" sections above for more specific information.

2. She states that "They are produced by the same gene responsible for the white tiger, palominos, Siamese cats and chincillas. This is a masking gene that suppresses the more common colours of the breed. White Dobermanns do have pigment, but they have a reduced amount of pigment. " see the quote here.

This statement is partially true, but misleading nonetheless.

It is true that most of these traits are thought to be caused by mutations in the same gene. Specifically, they are thought to be caused by mutations in the C gene, the gene that produces tyrosinase. As discussed in the "what is albinism" section above, therefore, these are all types of albinism.

However, these animals all have different mutations to the C gene. As explained above, white tigers still have black stripes -- while the normally black areas on albino Dobermans fade to cream. Similarly, Siamese cats can also have dark fur, while albino Dobermans do not. Palomino horses are heterozygous for an incomplete dominant trait, while albino dobermans are homozygous for a recessive trait. And Denise is confused about chinchillas -- while there is a type of albinism labelled "chinchilla" in some species, the normal chinchilla itself is not caused by a type of albinism.

See several photos of white tigers here.
Refer to the "what is albinism" and "are white dobermans really albino" sections above for more specific information on different types of albinism.

3. She states that "White Dobermanns are not photophobic (fear of light)." see the quote here.

It is a misconception that "photophobic" actually means "fear" of light. It does not.

As defined in the glossary of Medical Eye Services, photophobia is "Abnormal sensitivity to light." As defined in the Academic Press Dictionary of Science and Technology, photophobia is "an abnormal visual intolerance of light, as seen in albinism". And as defined in the On-Line Medical Dictionary, photophobia is "An abnormal visual intolerance of light." And, as discussed in the "AKC survey" and "problems reported by albino owners" sections above, many albino dobermans are abnormally sensitive to light -- in other words, they are photophobic.

Refer to the "AKC survey" and "problems reported by albino owners" sections above for more specific information.

4. She states that "Whites and White-Factored Dobes are claimed to suffer sunburn and skin cancer more than other colours. We have requested and searched for documentation on this, but so far have been unable to locate any." see the quote here.

For information on sunburn and skin cancer problems in albino dobermans and other albinos, start with the "does albinism affect health", "AKC survey", and "problems reported by albino owners" sections above.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , and "does albinism affect health" sections above for more specific information.

5. She states that "In 1994, the AKC (American Kennel Club) conducted its own survey of White Dobe owners and found that 85% were satisfied with their dogs. " see the quote here.

As discussed in the "AKC survey" section above, nearly half of the respondents to this survey reported problems with eyes, skin, or temperament, with several dogs suffering from two or more of these problems.

Refer to the "AKC survey" section above for more specific information.

6. She states that "Also, because of the controversy surrounding these dogs, many owners/breeders have actively pursued temperament testing (such as the Canine Good Citizen, obedience awards and Therapy Dog certification)." and "The American Kennel Club breed standard says that any unacceptable colour is a disqualifying fault in the conformation ring. Therefore, they are not shown in the U.S. However, they are registered and welcomed in ALL other AKC events." see the quote here.

As mentioned in the "does albinism affect behavior" and "performance title offer" sections, only four albino dobermans have obtained any AKC-sanctioned performance titles -- and these have only been CDs and one NAJ, the most basic of AKC-recognized titles. No albino dobermans have obtained any advanced performance titles, including agility, flyball, schutzhund, or any other organized dog sport.

Refer to the "does albinism affect behavior" and "performance title offer" sections above for more specific information.

7. She states that "Many (if not most breeds) have unacceptable colours (many unacceptable colours have BECOME acceptable), but only White Dobermanns are being met with unyielding bias and prejudice due to their colour." see the quote here.

Actually, as discussed in the "albinism in other breeds" section, albinism is disqualified in many breeds. In addition, non-albino white dogs (such as white boxers, white dalmatians, and white GSDs) are disqualified in many others.

Refer to the "albinism in other breeds" and "isn't albinism just another color" sections above for more specific information.

Navarre's House of Dobe makes the following false or misleading statements:

1. They state that their dogs are "Health-bred and certified" see the quote here.

Actually, NEITHER of their named dogs, Navarre's Great White Knight and Navarre's Fair Isabella, appear in the OFA (Orthopedic Foundation for Animals) database OR the CERF database. The "health certification" being claimed here may consist solely of a "veterinary health certificate" -- which actually is a document provided by a licensed veterinarian after nothing more than a physical examination, which certifies only that the dog being examined shows no signs of communicable disease at the time of the examination. A veterinary health certificate does not certify anything about the animal's genetic health.

to search the OFA database, look here; to search the CERF database, look here

A girl calling herself "Tuesday", who (although she claims that she is not a breeder) has advertised stud service by her two stud dogs (one albino-factored, one albino), makes the following false or misleading statements:

1. She states "Beware of all the lies that are being told about the White Doberman. They ARE NOT Albino as they are Positive Tyrosinase, meaning they have the enzyme that is necessary for the production of melanin, that gives them pigmentation." see the quote here.

Tuesday apparently doesn't understand that the term "tyrosinase positive" is specifically used to refer to a TYPE of albinism, in which the dog does retain some residual pigment production.

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "are white dobermans really albino" sections above for more specific information on different types of albinism.

2. She states "That is why the White Dobermans have markings and beautiful blue eyes, where an Albino is an animal that is white, has no markings and pink eyes." see the quote here.

Tuesday apparently doesn't understand that many albinos DO have residual markings, as well as blue eyes.

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "health" sections above for more specific information.

3. She states "White Dobermans are not a disqualifying genetic fault." see the quote here.

In fact, white Dobermans ARE disqualified from conformation competition with the AKC (American Kennel Club), and effectively disqualified from conformation competition with the CKC (Canadian Kennel Club) as well. The AKC standard specifically states: "Allowed Colors: Black, red, blue, and fawn (Isabella). Markings: Rust, sharply defined, appearing above each eye and on muzzle, throat and forechest, on all legs and feet, and below tail. White patch on chest, not exceeding 1/2 square inch, permissible. Disqualifying Fault: Dogs not of an allowed color. " The CKC standard states: "Smooth haired, short, hard, thick and close lying. Invisible grey undercoat on neck permissible. Allowed colours: black, red, blue and fawn. In each colour the more strongly pigmented coat is the more desirable. Markings: rust red, sharply defined, and appearing above each eye, and on muzzle, throat, forechest, on all legs and feet and below tail. White on chest not exceeding one-half square inch permissible."

Refer to the AKC standard for the Doberman Pinscher and the CKC standard for the Doberman Pinscher to see these quotes.

4. She states "They can be shown in the Confromation ring with the National Kennel Club, and in Obedience and Schutzhund trials with all other Kennel clubs, and many have earned such titles." see the quote here.

In fact, only THREE albino Dobermans have ANY AKC-recognized obedience titles, and these are only the most basic title allowed -- the CD. And there are NO albino dobermans with ANY verified Schutzhund titles. Except for one dog with an NAJ (the most basic of agility titles, earned on a course that does not even include the full range of agility obstacles faced on standar courses), I have not been able to find records of ANY albino Dobermans with ANY other verified performance titles, whether in obedience, schutzhund, agility, flyball, ring sport, tracking, or any of the other activities in which normal Dobermans excel. If albino Dobermans earned AKC obedience titles at the same rate as normal Dobermans, they would have earned roughly TWENTY CDs as well as many other titles by now. But they have not.

Refer to the "behavior" section above for more information.
I have made an offer to reward anyone who can obtain advanced performance titles on any albino Doberman. For details, please see the "Performance title offer" section below.

5. She states "Because of the info the DPCA told the AKC, The AKC did their own research of the White Doberman and conducted a 3 year study that ended in 1995, by talking to White Doberman owners, vets ,kennels, etc.. and found that 95% of owners were satisfied with their dogs and did not have health and temperament problems as was claimed." see the quote here.

In fact, the AKC survey tabulated results from less than 50 albino doberman owners, many of whom were breeders themselves or planned to become breeders. Although 89% (not 95%, as claimed above) of these owners did declare an overall satisfaction with their dogs, nearly half of these same owners did indeed admit to having problems with vision, skin, and/or temperament. Some even stated that they would never own albinos again because of severe problems.

For more specific information on this survey, see the "AKC survey" section above.

6. She states "Just so that you know...."culled" means killed... Breeders who do not like the white Dobermans cull the new borns....Breeders sometimes take a new born pup and bash their heads up against a wall, with a hammer, or anything hard. They will also drown them in a tub of water or let them starve to death. I don't know about you but this makes me outraged. They say it is to protect their breed!!!what do you think.So when you read about something and breeders or organizations say "culled" this is what they mean....What's next, culling our children!!! " see the quote here.

The recurrent accusation of massive culling by DPCA members is a common scare tactic amongst breeders of albino Dobermans. In fact, NO responsible breeder produces albinos by accident. Therefore, there is NO situation in which white Dobermans would be culled at birth by responsible breeders of normal dobermans. ALL AKC registered Dobermans which might be carrying the albino trait are listed in the "z list", and those born after 1996 are registered with special registration numbers beginning with "WZ". Therefore, any responsible breeder can easily check the z list to be sure that they do NOT breed to a dog which might carry this trait.

The z list can be found here.

Last update 6/7/01

Candy Cornett, who owns the albino dog Kathy Bates' Ice Phantom, makes several misleading statements. In this case, her statements are misleading because Candy brags about wins and placements without telling the whole story about the specific competitions in which she was involved.

1. She states: "The following pics were taken at the Tulsa Dog Training Club AKC Trial in Kellyville, OK on May 12-13....This was the trial where I finally earned my first qualifying score (first leg) in JWW and won the class to boot! " see the quote here

The trial actually took place on May 13-14. Except for that minor glitch, this statement is technically true. However, at this trial Ice Phantom was first -- out of a grand total of two entrants. And, in fact, the other entrant did not even qualify!

These results can be verified

2. She states: "On Saturday, Sept. 23rd, we got a qualifying score in the Jumpers with Weaves (our 2nd leg) AND TOOK A FIRST PLACE RIBBON OVER ALL OTHER NOVICE A HANDLERS IN THE 24" DIVISION! " see the quote here

This is also technically true. And, in fact, there were six entrants in her class at this trial. However, Ice Phantom was again the only dog to even qualify.

These results can be verified

3. She states: "On Sunday, Sept. 24th, we got a qualifying score in the Novice Jumpers with Weaves which was our third and final leg for Novice!!!! NOT ONLY THAT, BUT WE ALSO TOOK A SECOND PLACE RIBBON!!!! " see the quote here

This is also technically true. However, at this trial Ice Phantom was second -- out of a grand total of two entrants! Is getting second place out of two really something to shout about? Similarly, the current president of the WDC once congratulated Denise Harrison of Dobenar Kennels for a fourth place "win" when the pup in question -- Dobenar's Wonderfully Wicked -- had actually placed fourth out of a class of four!

These results can be verified
The story of Dobenar's Wonderfully Wicked can be seen here

Now, everyone should congratulate Candy for competing and earning a title with her dog, and support her in her efforts. After all, Ice Phantom is one of only four albino Dobermans to ever earn an AKC recognized performance title in the history of the breed. However, the fact that Candy exaggerated Ice's achievements by reporting them out of context makes it much harder to be happy for her overall.

Somebody sent me a great old joke that illustrates this idea perfectly. I've taken the liberty of modifying it slightly to fit this specific situation. It goes: "a normal dobe and an albino dobe run a race. The normal dobe crosses the finish line first. The normal dobe says he won and the albino lost. The albino says he came in second and the normal dobe came in second to last."

Last update 6/28/01

NOTE: The Karmikel's site has been removed by its web server, freeservers.com . I am leaving these critiques here in case the statements become available again on another server in the near future, but please be advised that any links to the Karmikel's site do not work at the present time (6/28/01).

Karly Weems, of Karmikel's Dobermans, makes the following false or misleading claims:

1. She states: "Karmikel's Georgio Armani. Armani was our first doberman. He was the love of our lives, out of mulitple champion bloodlines. Sadly Armani died tragically in March, 1998 from skin Cancer. He would have turned five years old June 11th, 1998. We miss you dearly Armani." see the quote here

Actually, there is no dog in the AKC database named "Karmikel's Georgio Armani" or "Karmikels Georgio Armani" or "Karmikel Georgio Armani", whether Georgio is spelled with an "e" or an "i". Why use a false registered name, if her claims about him are true? In fact, Karly has admitted elsewhere that this dog came from a kennel whose dogs often turn up in rescue, and which has a very poor reputation amongst responsible Doberman breeders.

to search the AKC database, go here
for more details on the origin of this dog, please contact me

2. She also mentions a dog she calls "Karmikel's Eboney Eyes", and says "Eboney is a daughter of Karmikel's Georgio Armani and Karmikel's Tasha Fergetmenot." see the quote here

As with Armani, neither "Karmikel's Eboney Eyes" nor "Karmikel's Tasha Fergetmenot"Ê appear in the AKC database. Once again we must ask: why use false registered names, if her statements are true?

to search the AKC database, go here

3. She states: "There seems to be some question to my dogs name and lineage. Here is a copy of Armani's pedigree, hand written and signed by his breeder Gerrie Hart. " see the quote here

Actually, Karly provides two hand-written pedigrees -- one for a dog named Agape's Gates of the Temple, and one for a dog named Shal-Mar's Tequila Sunrise. There is actually no pedigree for "Karmikel's Georgio Armani" anywhere on the site. Once again we must ask the simple question -- why?

see the pedigrees here

4. She states: "VH's Karmikels Giovanni - Pedigree -- Gio's Grandsire is Victorian Diamond Mine who will be 10 years old this year. " see the quote here

This statement is true. However, Karly neglects to mention that Giovanni's sire was Thunderidge's King of Diamonds, who recently died at six years of age. see his memorial here

5. She states: "AKC Ribbons Here are some ribbons I have won with my WZ Doberman BFPD-Karmikel's Crown Jewel. She has lovely conformation, and the proof is in the prizes, LOOK we won Best in Breed or Variety, and First in Group! " and "White and white factored Dobermans CAN WIN! I choose to show my black female Jewel at AKC sanctioned conformation matches, just for fun, and to prove that you CAN win even with a "Z". AKC matches are more relaxed, and earn no points, however it is still a good tool for you to use to find out how your dog compares to others conformation wise. Jewel was a star, however after winning and proving my point that when judges dont see "Z"....but a dobe, we both have since retired from the show ring." see the quotes here

Additionally, the sales brochure for Karmikel's Dobermans states: "Karmikels Crown Jewel, Black and Tan female currently being shown at AKC confirmation [sic] trials" for a copy of the Karmikel's brochure, please contact me

The essential phrase here is "just for fun". This dog was shown at MATCHES, not shows or trials. She has earned NO AKC conformation points, because matches are -- as Karly stated -- "just for fun", as well as for handling practice. They may not even be judged by real AKC licensed judges. In fact, anyone, including your next door neighbor, is allowed to "judge" at a match.

As stated on the AKC site: "The primary purpose of this type of event is to give members of the clubs the opportunity to demonstrate their knowledge and competence in handling the details of a Dog Show" -- NOT "to find out how your dog compares to others conformation wise". The ONLY venues that actually let you "find out how your dog compares to others conformation wise" are AKC sanctioned SHOWS.

AKC regulations for sanctioned matches can be found here

Once again -- for some reason, we see albino breeders avoiding the real show rings. Why?

6. She states: "This is the darkest litter of white puppies I have ever seen! Again I have to stress the fact that white Dobermans are NOT BORN LIGHT, they are born DARK! Ivy's puppies all have very dark tan coats with very distinct pure white markings. This again proves the point that white Dobermans are not and CANNOT be albinos! They have pigment, TONS of dark pigmented fur, FROM BIRTH! There is no argument, because the photos do not lie, WHITE DOBERMANS ARE NOT ALBINOS!" and ""White Doberman puppies are not albino! They are born with dark creme pigment, and have blue eyes. They ARE NOT born light, as some people who know nothing about white Dobermans might try to tell you! This photo is taken at three days old (Please show me photos of 3 day old puppies that are born light?) you can easily see the dark creme pigment in contrast to the white markings." see the quotes here

Other breeders of albino Dobermans have made statements and provided photos which contradict Karly's claims about albino Doberman puppies being born dark. For instance, you can find photos and descriptions of albino puppies born very pale and growing up darker here and here (this dog has eventually built up so much pigment that his eyes have even become gold); and more photos of pale puppies here , here, here, and here. However, it should not be at all surprising to find out that some albino Dobermans are born darker than others. Since they are partial albinos, some may very well have more residual pigment production than others.

Refer to the "what is albinism" section elsewhere on this site for more details on how albinos may build up additional pigment over time, and how pigment may vary between animals.

7. She states: "If this dog were an actual albino it would be all white with pink eyes. " see the quote here and "Many will try to tell you lies about the white doberman, but the FACT remains that true albino dogs always have pink eyes. " see the quote here and "However dogs without pink eyes can never be complete albinos, no matter how much you skew the facts! IN CANINES ALBINOS MUST HAVE PINK EYES!" see the quote here

As demonstrated many times on this site, albinos do NOT have to be all white nor have pink eyes. Even complete albinos often have blue eyes.

For example, Dr. William Oetting -- a geneticist and expert in albinism -- states: "The blue eyes is consistent with albinism. Dogs have an iris which is blue if it contains no pigment (same as the Siamese cat, for example, which also has a type of albinism). Animals with little or no iris (mouse, rat) have pink eyes. Humans with OCA1 have 'pink' eyes because the blue iris is translucent and light from inside the eye is transmitted through the pupil and the iris giving a pink color - their eyes are really blue! "

Interestingly, Karly even contradicts herself at one point. When discussing a different dog, Karly states: "This dog could be all grey with pink eyes and still be a complete albino." see the quote here Well, which is it?? Does Karly think that albinos have to be white, or not?

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "health" sections elsewhere on this site for more specific information, and see Dr. Oetting's complete statement here.

8. She states: "White Dobermans can live long healthy lives, and are not albinos! " see the quote here and "WHITE DOBERMANS ARE NOT ALBINO! " see the quote here

Karly claims that albino Dobermans "are not albinos". Her opinion, however, differs from scientific findings and conclusions of multiple experts in the fields of genetics, albinism, and pathology. If anyone actually has factual evidence that "white" Dobermans are not albino, please let me know!

Additionally, if anyone has factual evidence of any "white" Dobermans living more than ten years, please let me know. I only have records of two albino Dobermans in the history of the mutation who have lived as long as ten years; in contrast, it is easy to find normal Dobermans living 11, 12, or even as much as 14 or 17 years of age.

Refer to the "what is albinism" and "are white dobermans really albino" sections elsewhere on this site for more specific information on albinism, and refer to the "health" and "ethical breeding" sections for more specific information on health and longevity.

9. She states: "White Dobermans are not the only breed to have off colored dogs who are attacked by parent clubs. There are several examples of this that can be seen in Parti, white or cinnamon Schnauzers, brindle pugs, or even red Rottweillers, all of which are usually considered "disqualifying genetic faults." This link is provided to show the erie similarities in wordage used by the American Rottweiller Club vs. the DPCA's "Operation White Out," of white Dobermans."

The wording may very well be similar. However, the situations with red rottweilers and color variants in other breeds are VERY different than that found with albino Dobermans. "Red" in rottweilers is JUST a color. It is caused by the recessive b gene, just as it is in dobermans. The red color has no established health or behavioral effects. Similarly, the brindle color has no known health effects. I have not researched the situation in schnauzers, but it is likely that the parti and white schnauzers carry the spotting gene. As described with boxers and dalmatians elsewhere on this site, extreme spotting can cause problems such as deafness -- so it should not be surprising if breed clubs want to avoid that problem.

Refer to the "albinism in other breeds" and "isn't albinism just another color" sections above for more specific information.

10. She states: "Fortunately parent clubs do not affect the AKC registration process"

Actually, the DPCA -- parent club for the Doberman Pinscher in the United States -- was the force behind obtaining z registration for every descendant of Shebah.

The DPCA's Operation White Out policy can be found here

11.. She states: "This link is provided to show a TRUE ALBINO Bichon Friese, WITH PINK EYES. Please scroll down to Sugar and River to see this miraculous PINK EYED albino dog." see the quote here

Actually, there is nothing miraculous about this dog -- and, since black pigment is clearly visible on his nose, he is obviously also not an oculocutaneous albino. Remember, the technical term for "albinism" is OculoCutaneous Albinism (OCA) -- meaning that the eyes AND skin both lack pigmentation.

The page she is referring to is here ; the photo of the dog Sugar can be accessed directly here .
Refer to the "what is albinism" section elsewhere on this site for more specific information on what makes an animal albino

Karly apparently doesn't realize that bichons are white because of the extreme piebald trait. This means that melanocytes, the cells which produce pigment, are not distributed over the entire body. In most bichons, the melanocytes will travel to the eyes (which are normally dark), the nose (again, normally dark), lips, and so on -- leaving the fur white. This dog, Sugar, most likely has an abnormality in that extreme piebald trait. It appears that the melanocytes did travel to part of the nose, but not to the eyes.

Bichon color genetics are mentioned here and here

12. She states: "We proudly offer AKC registered puppies for sale that are health certified" see the quote here

Actually, none of Karly's breeding dogs appear in either the OFA or CERF databases. In fact, her "health certification" appears to consist solely of a "veterinary health certificate". This is actually a document provided by a licensed veterinarian after nothing more than a physical examination, which certifies only that the dog being examined shows no signs of communicable disease at the time of the examination. A veterinary health certificate does not certify anything about the animal's genetic health.

Additionally, Karly's first stud dog -- the one she refers to as "Karmikel's Georgio Armani" -- died at four years of age, while her first brood bitch -- the one she refers to as "Karmikel's Tasha Fergetmenot" -- also died at around four years of age. And Karly has complained vociferously about the multiple health problems that Armani suffered with during his short life. She has said, amongst other things, that "He was Hyperthyroid, vWDÊ affected, diagnosed with wobblers at age 2 and died of skin cancer at age 4. " and that his "line was full of health problems" for copies of her emails on this subject, please contact me Nonetheless, Karly bred these dogs to each other at LEAST three times -- and she has just bred one of their daughters to one of her albino dogs. Another brood bitch of hers, Karmikel's Aspen Extreme, has been breed at least three times before even reaching the age of two years. Does any of this sound like any kind of "health certified" breeding practices?

Also interesting, three of the dogs mentioned on Karly's site -- Karmikel's Georgio Armani, Karmikel's Tasha Fergetmenot, and Karmikel's Eboney Eyes -- do not appear in the AKC database. Either Karly is using false names for these dogs, or they are not AKC registered at all. This brings up the inevitable question: are her puppies truly AKC registered, as she claims?

to search the OFA database, look here; to search the CERF database, look here; to search the AKC database, look here

13.Ê She states: "Assessment of Materials on Blue Eyed Cream Horses Authored by D.Phillip Sponenberg, DVM, PhD....Cremello horses have near identical color patterns to white Dobermans, that being cream base coats, white markings, pink skin, and blue eyes. This article is full of valuable information and facts noted by a PRACTICING DVM!" see the quote here

This is true, so far as it goes. However, Karly appears to be ignorant of the fact that the cremello trait does NOT cause rust colors to become white, as the albino trait does in Dobermans; and even more importantly, she also appears ignorant of the fact that the cremello trait is an incomplete dominant trait -- rather than a recessive trait, as the albino trait is in Dobermans. (This apparent ignorance is rather surprising, since I've told Karly this fact myself at least twice in the past.) In other words, the cremello trait in horses is not the same as the albino trait in Dobermans. As Dr. Sponenberg has told me himself in relation to the cremello trait, "They are the result of an incompletely dominant gene, which makes the gene function less extreme than for most albinos. " for a copy of Dr. Sponenberg's email, please contact me

In other words, it is extremely misleading to compare cremello horses with albino Dobermans. They are not comparable traits.

14. She states: "These are not pshcho ramblings by a vet whos license was revoked, who specialized filed is supposedly Amazon Parrots, but a REAL VET and PROFESSOR specialized in Pathology and Genetics! Please read this article if you are considering any merit to the IONE SMITH REVOKED DVM PAGES! " see the quote here and "The TRUTH behind the lies of Ione Smith REVOKED DVM! There is a woman named Ione Smith who claims to be a DVM." and "we all know she has her DVM license revoked almost ten years ago however she still posts the title forgetting to mention that is has been revoked?" see the quotes here

It is understandable that Karly is angry with me. After all, it must be quite embarrassing for her to have her false and/or misleading advertising exposed in this way. Nonetheless, one might wish her to be more responsible with the accusations she throws around in public.

As Karly well knows, I am indeed a graduate veterinarian. The degree, Doctor of Veterinary Medicine, was awarded to me by the University of Tennessee College of Veterinary Medicine, in 1988. As it happens -- and as many people already know --I allowed my Tennessee veterinary license to lapse in about 1990, since I was practicing in Utah at the time and didn't need the Tennessee license. And, since I elected to return to school and leave clinical practice, I never renewed the license. Unfortunately, the TN Veterinary Board chooses to record such lapsed licenses as being "administratively revoked" (meaning that I'm not allowed to practice clinical medicine because I didn't pay to keep the license current). The pro-albino contingent has unsuccessfully tried to mislead people by misusing the beaurocratic terminology; and they fail to realize that the DVM degree itself is NEVER revoked. Again -- one might wish that these people would be more responsible with the accusations they throw around in public.

for an officialcopy of my veterinary school transcript, please contact me

15. She states: "Black Dobermans suffer from photophobia??? Well now isnt this interesting, this black Doberman puppy
Êdoes NOT carry the white gene, in fact she is a WR registered Doberman, and you can easily see that she is squinting against the bright sunlight of a hot summers day. I found this photo rather interesting, and enlightening in fact. I guess there is a new argument that black Dobermans suffer from photophobia as well and should not be allowed to be bred? " and "Well as you can see it is very common for dark eyed, dark skinned dogs regardless of breed to be seen squinting against bright sunlight." see the quotes here

Of course, most ANY animal will squint when its face is held straight towards the sun in bright sunlight. That should not be surprising to anyone. The problem arrives when animals -- whether albino dogs or people -- must even squint in lower light conditions, which don't affect normal animals.

There are many examples of such photosensitivity in albino Dobermans.

Refer to the "AKC survey" , "problems reported by albino owners" , "does albinism affect health" , and "does albinism affect behavior" sections elsewhere on this site for more specific information on some of the ways in which albinism affects health and behavior

16. She states: "There are several DOCUMENTED cases of red Dobermans suffering from severe sunburns as well." see the quote here

Interestingly, Karly doesn't actually provide any of this supposed documentation. Why not?

17. While describing one of her new pups, she states: " She has a lovely high neck placement" see the quote here

Interestingly, Karly herself has criticized high neck placement in the past, saying things like "YOU are the type of breeder who wants that neck placement so high that we end up with CVI." for a copy of Karly's email, please contact me

So -- does Karly think that high neck placement is good, or not?

18. She proudly proclaims: "NO INBREEDING! " see the quote here

Interestingly, Karly herself has criticized outbreeding in the past, saying things like "So are you advocating outcrossing all the time?Ê You do realize that with outcrossing you hide the recessives so they can just spring out at you later. You haven't solved the problem, you've just hidden them for a while maybe."for a copy of Karly's email, please contact me

So -- does Karly think that outbreeding is good, or not?

Last update 6/7/01

John Sawbridge, aka doberacer, who owns Dobermans in the UK, makes the following false or misleading claims:

1. John states: "Surely it is time breeders stopped playing God by deciding what creatures will die and which will live just because their looks donât suit them." see the quote here

Actually, as has been stated many times, Operation White-Out is about spaying and neutering albino Dobermans, not killing them.

The DPCA's Operation White Out policy can be found here

2. John states: "This is about the white issue ,concerning not only the white boxer dogs but also Dobermans, dalmations and anything that is born white,which some people class as albinos." see the quote here

Actually, as has also been stated many times, white boxers and white dalmatians are NOT albino, but rather are examples of the extreme spotting trait (also called extreme piebald). Further, the situations with boxers and dalmatians are VERY different than with white Dobermans, since the albino trait is isolated from the normal population in Dobermans, while the spotting trait is spread throughout the boxer and dalmatian populations.

For more specific information on white boxers, look here and here.
For more specific information on white and/or albino dogs in other breeds, refer to the "white dogs in other breeds" section elsewhere on this site

3. John states: "they also go